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Poster: BryanE Date: Mar 14, 2007 10:05am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Rock and Roll Hall of Idiocy

Perhaps this subject has been discussed here, but if it was, I missed it. American Beauty recently made the Top 20 of a list of 200 "definitive" rock albums as compiled by some people connected with the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. That might sound good, but it is really a dubious honor at best. The Grateful Dead are listed at #20, but coming in right behind American Beauty at #21, that all-time rock classic, Come On Over by Shania Twain, which rates one ranking higher than Who's Next, and rates 179 rankings higher than anything by Eric Clapton, because there is not a single Clapton album on this definitive list-no Layla, no Slowhand. But there is an album by Cream---wait, I'm sorry. That's not Cream, that's Creed.

I'm tellin' ya', boyzengirls, this thing singlehandedly redefines absurdity. Nothing from Clapton; if you want to Eat A Peach, you'll just have to visit your grocer's produce section; and God forbid that Zappa and The Mothers would even be given any consideration whatsoever. But you can bet your ass that the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame's list of 200 definitive rock albums includes the original Broadway cast recording of Phantom of the Opera and the Titanic soundtrack, along with albums from Beyonce', Kenny G, and Barbra Streisand. The thing is inundated with rap and hip-hop, but you sure as hell won't see Machine Head, Bridge of Sighs, or The Smoker You Drink/The Player You Get, and surely ol' Alice Cooper wrote off any recognition by the HOF long ago. Deja Vu made the list, but it's by Crosby, Stills, and Nash. Neil did get thrown a bone, though, with Harvest included among such masterpieces as LL Cool J's Mama Said Knock You Out, Writing's On The Wall by Destiny's Child, and two-count 'em-two from the Dixie Chicks. Ultimately, I have reached the conclusion that the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame has shown its true colors here as being nothing more than a thinly disguised shill for the record companies in their effort to legitimize the work of a slew of overpaid, undertalented hacks as somehow being "important."

What was originally intended as a project to deservedly enshrine the artists whose music shaped and helped to define contemporary Western culture has turned into a laughable travesty. Ovewhelmingly, this stupid list has about as much to do with rock as ice hockey has to do with Australian Aborigines. There just isn't any logical reason for them to be included in the same thought. I can't recall who was inducted during the same ceremony as The Grateful Dead, but it seems that it took place when the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame was still paying tribute to the bands and people who are genuinely part of the history of rock and roll as a genre unto itself. I can follow the argument that hip-hop, for instance, evolved out of rock---somehow or another---but as a fervent fan of rock and roll music for just about 40 years, therefore believing that my opinion is just as valid as the next guy's, hip-hop isn't rock and roll any more than The Phantom of the Opera or Barbara Streisand are. Once they build a Rap and Hip-Hop Hall of Fame, then Grandmaster Flash should be numero uno in their hallowed cathedral. In the meantime, the fact that he is now one of the honorees in Cleveland just goes to prove how far away from what is truly rock and roll that the voting committee has steered itself. If Grandmaster Flash deserves recognition, and I only continue to pick on him to make my particular point, while John Mayall does not, then I find myself at a loss to understand what criteria are actually being used. Meanwhile, Michael Richards is banished into psychological counseling for screaming "nigger" repeatedly in his stand-up act, while Patti Smith goes in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame with a performance of Rock and Roll Nigger. Because of some hypocritical reasoning of "perspective" applied to the use of the word, she's considered an artist, Richards is a racist, and I'm left scratching my head.

When The Grateful Dead were inducted, Jerry was not present. He was still alive, he just wasn't at the ceremony. While I'm unable to remember if he had a gig with his own band or whether he simply chose not to participate because of his iconoclastic nature, I would prefer to believe the latter was the case. Either way, he's probably up there somewhere having a good laugh at the ridiculous 200 list.

The list:
http://www.definitive200.com/200_list.php

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Poster: JamminJerome Date: Mar 14, 2007 10:52am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Rock and Roll Hall of Idiocy

It looked like something I might see in Rolling Stones. But man, R&R HOF? oh man. I almost barfed a lung when I saw things like Linkin Park, Creed, Celine Dion, and Kenny G in the top 100. Thanks, BryanE, for warning about the Shania Twain right after the Dead, because if unwarned I would have soiled my pants.

It is also really random. It's as if they wanted to include a bunch of genres on there, so they threw in great albums such as Miles Davis's Kind of Blue and Dave Brubeck's Time Out that don't really belong on a Rock n Roll list. The rap and cheesy pop (and musical soundtracks) also don't belong, but BryanE dealt with those.

It seriously looked like a bunch of random people got together and said, "Hey, here's some albums we like. Let's throw them all together in some kind of random order. Oh yeah, but don't forget to put Sgt. Pepper at #1 and Highway 61 Revisited in the top 10 so people think the list is legit."

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Poster: mudcatbluez Date: Mar 14, 2007 12:52pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Rock and Roll Hall of Idiocy

Hey Bryan--great to see you back!

Yeah, the list is bogus. As many such lists as we've been treated to over the years, you'd think we'd expect to be cheesed off by their inclusions/omissions. Expecting different would make us optimists...and I'd never admit to that.

No Electric Ladyland? No Layla? But we do have the Titanic soundtrack. We also have at least 3 entries from Michael Jackson, who wouldn't know rock & roll if he were fudge-packed with it.

And where the hell's the Partridge Family!?! WTF!?!

Peace folks...

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Poster: mudcatbluez Date: Mar 14, 2007 1:10pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Rock and Roll Hall of Idiocy

BTW, I find it cool and Dead-distinctive that I've come to rely heavily on the "Top Lists" the Heads post around these parts. Some of the very best shows I've come across have been as a direct result from listening to a whole lot of you folks.

You continue to blow my mind.

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Poster: Bird Creek, Alaska Date: Mar 14, 2007 12:31pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Rock and Roll Hall of Idiocy

Yes the list may be stupid, but have you been to the Rock Hall of Fame. Very nice, even for Cleveland.

It has been a few years since I was there, but I could not make it through the entire building in one day.

A great display of Jerry guitars. John Lennon was the featured artist.

I believe that Reggae was the last feature. With Toots playing a concert?

If ever in Cleveland for any reason it is a must.

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Poster: BryanE Date: Mar 14, 2007 4:30pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Rock and Roll Hall of Idiocy

Can't say that I have, and should I ever return to Cleveland, a city that I called home for a brief period, I would definitely stop in for a look-see, and without feeling at all two-faced about it, either. When the funding, planning, design, and all else finally fell in place to nail it together, I was thrilled. For years I would practically hold my breath annually to see who would be among the next names to be added to the list of honorees, and my wife has stated repeatedly that she wants at some point for us to make the trip. As a museum, I would love to see it.
But as an accurate representation of rock and roll that mattered deeply to those who grew up listening to it from the 50's through the 70's, I hold to my contention that the place has become a sham. Not the building, mind you, but the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame as an institution is a sham. It isn't clear who they're catering to anymore, but I don't believe that it's to the Average Joe Rock Fan. And that's why he will most likely never see any of the heroes of his youth in the Hall, be they Yes or Jethro Tull, Ted Nugent or The Guess Who, Steppenwolf or The Moody Blues. And that's only scratching the surface. I enjoyed the hell out of REM when I saw them I few years back, but cutting them in line in front of Steve Miller, The Doobie Bros., Heart, Canned Heat, Three Dog Night, and even The MC5 . . . well, I've made my point.

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Poster: ghostofpig Date: Mar 14, 2007 1:41pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Rock and Roll Hall of Idiocy

Why on earth would you expect anything different?

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Poster: BryanE Date: Mar 14, 2007 4:30pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Rock and Roll Hall of Idiocy

Excellent question.

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Poster: Arbuthnot Date: Mar 14, 2007 11:43am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Rock and Roll Hall of Idiocy

Bryan ... your musical acumen (am i spelling this right?) is always spot on and a pleasure to read, and yes, you've said/written just perfectly what i myself was thinking. Looking over that list, well, just perfectly exemplifies why i left off listening to music radio, for the most part, years and years ago. But it goes without saying, and sorry for pointing out the obvious, the world is filled with the vacuous and the ignorant, people who mostly prefer the "music" with which they stuff their day with, to be machine-created, pipe-fed, factory-spawned. And hey, that's cool for them, 'cause that's what gets them off at the end of the day, but it's just unfortunate that the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame must feel the need to cater to this dribble. Not that i am surprised of course, as culture has long headed into the toilet. Oh, and if my two pence pisses anyone off, hey, i ain't no hippie, and a good day to ya!

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Poster: Fishead Date: Mar 14, 2007 12:14pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Rock and Roll Hall of Idiocy

they make these list for folk like you who get all bent out of shape over some stupid poll that is meaningless in the grand scheme of things . in other words who gives a fuck what they think .don't worry about it . just ignore it until the next useless poll comes out. you know the truth . you have been around long enough to know nothing makes sense
anymore . so either laugh at it or just ignore it. why get bent over it.

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Poster: dc2 Date: Mar 14, 2007 12:30pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Rock and Roll Hall of Idiocy

81% of us polled agree with you.

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Poster: Arbuthnot Date: Mar 14, 2007 1:36pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Rock and Roll Hall of Idiocy

"they make these list[s] for folk[s] like you who get all bent out of shape..."

[actually, i don't believe the lists are put together for this purpose, nor did or do i get the sense that Bryan was bent out of shape, but merely expressing/voicing his commentary and observations about an idiom that he works very closely with, feels passionate about, and if i recall, has been involved with for a good number of years, and by every stretch of the imagination, knows a good deal more than most, myself included, and so i welcome his voice and input, and yours as well, even if in this instance, i think you miss the mark.]

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